Denise 0:05
Welcome, again to Myth, Magic, M edicine Season 3, which is '2 immigrant doctors talking'. And my guest today is Anca Sisu, who is from Romania. Hi, and thank you so much for joining me.
Anca 0:19
Hi, Denise, thank you for having me. I'm excited to have this talk with you.
Denise 0:24
Have you done many podcasts? A lot of our fellow physicians now have podcast?
Anca 0:29
Not very many. Just a couple.
Denise 0:32
So, when did you arrive in the US?
Anca 0:36
About 20 years ago, soon, it's gonna be 20 years.
Denise 0:39
Okay. And it was right after you finished training in Romania.
Anca 0:43
Yeah, so I finished training and then I did about eight months of residency there, and then I moved.
Denise 0:49
Okay. Okay, so let's try and be organized. It's not really my forte, but let's try and be organized. So you grew up in Romania, you're much younger than me. So you didn't experience communist regime as much as many of my friends did? Can you talk a little bit about the history of Romania and then the history of medical training in Romania? Because I know your school has been around since the mid 1800s.
Anca 1:19
Right. Right.Yeah, so you know, I grew up in a small town near Danube, and, you know, when communism fell, I was 12. And, you know, I got some of it, in through my parents through the stories and through some personal experience.And then, you know, we, we started, things started changing for the better. And we, you know, we gained our freedom. And with that comes some responsibility and some changes, and, you know, resistance from some people and excitement from the younger people. And, yeah, so it was, in a way, a pretty clear path. I loved helping people and I, from an early age, I wanted to be a doctor. And then, you know, I applied to medical school, which is in Bucharest, about three hours away from where I lived, and I moved there for the six years. So just six years of medical school years there.
Denise 2:20
I'll just point out because many people don't realize the differences, the differences in what you learn in medical school. very little, most people learn the same stuff. But how to get to medical school medical school, follows immediately have the equivalent of high school, right? Yeah, right. From high school into medicine. Was there a particular entrance exam you needed to take?
Anca 2:39
Yeah, yeah, it was a pretty tough entrance exam, you have to take biology and biochemistry and physics tests. And, you know, I prepared for that for a couple of years. And, you know, it's, they only took a certain number of people they were the year I took the exam, it was just a quarter of the people got admitted. So it was a pretty tough exam.
Denise 3:06
How many people were in your class entering class? Um,
Anca 3:11
well, we were. I don't remember exactly about 500.
Denise 3:19
It was pretty big. And how many medical schools in the country as a whole?
Anca 3:23
Think about six, five or six?
Denise 3:26
Okay. And most of them do take foreign students as well. Certainly now. Yes. And you were in the capital city at Carol Davila? Yes.
Was that because that was the closest to your home or where you just wanted to be - in the Capitol?
Anca 3:41
There was both it was, you know, I like to believe the most reputable Of course, other people argue that their school was the best, but and it was closer to home. And it was important for me to be in touch with my family and be able to them some weekends.
Denise 3:59
Yeah. So you start school there. In October. school year starts in October, right? The how, how many months of the year did you study?
Anca 4:13
It ends in in June. So it's definitely September, mid September that you start back?
Denise 4:21
Yeah, I must. Disclaimer, I have a family member who went to Romania to study medicine. I remember he was required to do certain number of weeks during the summer, which he could do in the US. But he had to summer volunteer from the first year of medicine. Was that true for you also, work in the hospital during the summer
Anca 4:43
was optional in the first three years and then I did it for you know, to get one more experienced before internship.
Denise 4:52
It's possible it was optional for him, but he certainly didn't let me know that. So, um, okay, so what were the first things? Do you think there's any difference, having now had experience meeting with medical students here who are training in the US? Do you think there's any difference in the way the curriculum is set up from the US?
Anca 5:13
Yeah. So you know, I trained 20 plus years ago, and we didn't have so much access to like high quality books, you you had books that were underlined with three different colors, and you're lucky to have a newer one. And, you know, there was less study materials, I would say, you can see here, you know, the skeleton is the pelvis, like all the bones, and we had like real bones in anatomy.
Denise 5:43
We have my body that's built way back. I have I graduated 40 years ago, we have real ones. That's not allowed anymore. Yeah.
Anca 5:52
I know. Yeah. So yeah, I think we had to figure out way more and especially because internet was, was not available when I was in school. You know, we relied heavily on books and our, our professors, teachers had to give us extra materials. And yeah, it was, it was different. I think, you know, the access to technology make things much easier nowadays.
Denise 6:19
So my question really was more, did you think that the order in which they approach. At my school, and actually, the first two semesters, it was like 60%, anatomy and all the other subjects split around? Is it similar for you is the order of presentation of the work the same do you think as here?
Anca 6:37
I think it's similar, I think we were one of the highest, we had the highest number of anatomy hours actually, in Europe, when I looked at the study, they were saying Romanian schools, and it you know, it felt like a lot. You know, well,
Denise 6:53
when you go through it, it always feels like a lot.
Anca 6:55
It's it's similar, but the number of hours allocated to each discipline is different.
Denise 7:03
How many years or hours, if you think in hours, did you have before you actually saw your first patient?
Anca 7:12
Well, in the first three years, it's more theory, and then you start seeing patients so I'd say in the third year, you're actually...
Denise 7:21
You start to do rounds with people? And is your initial is your last year of medical school? setting you up for a license? Is that, like an internship year? It's an all clinical at the end? Or is that different now?
Anca 7:36
Yeah. So I would say, you know, in the in the last three years, you do you do clinicals. And you take tests based on those clinicals. But the last year, it was a mix, I mean, we just, we just finished, we you rotate through all the specialties pretty much and then you, you have an exam to get into residency, and that exam was pretty tough, too. And I think the system there is much different, where the top people get to choose their specialty, and then it's kind of a sliding scale. So if you don't have a really high score, then you might not get into the residency of your choice, there is no matching process like it is here.
Denise 8:12
Do you have the opportunity to declare what you would like to study prior to the exam? Or do you have to wait for the results? Yeah, so you say I'm looking to do this? And they say, sorry, no, yeah.
Anca 8:22
Because, you know, there's actually a track for surgical specialties and attract for medical. And so, you know, I opted for medical, and you can put your option there, but, you know, they're, they're gonna give it to you if it's available.
Denise 8:37
The postgraduate training there, I know you need a little bit of it there. But postgraduate training there is you come out do you do a year in general medicine? Or do they already they specialize you
Anca 8:48
right away? They start specializing right away?
Denise 8:51
within what we would consider a subspecialty of medicine, you come out and do internal medicine or do you do hematology? Or do you do? Oh,
Anca 9:00
yes. So you do internal medicine and the first year if you're in internal medicine, yeah, I did family medicine. And so you know, you you have to have those rotations in the hospital. And it's a certain curriculum similar to here, I would say and you have to go patients go see patients in the clinic as well.
Denise 9:20
At what point in your studies did you realize that you wanted to come to the US to get graduate training?
Anca 9:27
Well, you know, it's it was in my third year of medical school, when I got got the opportunity to come to United States my my godparents were here in California and they invited me over. So it was an eye opening experience for me, and it so happens that their son was a physical therapist. So looking at his books, he had the pathology book that I really loved. He ended up gifting it to me where he said, you know, you just read that book is just just take it I'm gonna buy another All righty. But you know, I was so fascinated to see the explanations and the graphs and the pictures and, and, you know, way, it was much easier if you're passionate about something to follow your passion. And then, you know, I kind of made my mind on on the way back home that I'm gonna be back it was, you know, when when I got back home for a month I was I was myself. So my mom was like, What's going on with you? And I said, I'm just gonna go back. It was a set deal. I just didn't know how but but I knew I'll find a way.
Denise 10:39
And what path did you use? Obviously, as I know the answer to this question, but for the purposes of the interview, what did you decide was going to be your path? Because getting as a physician and getting to the US from an immigration point of view can be quite difficult. What did you decide what would be the best route for you?
Anca 11:00
You know, it was interesting. My godmother was also in the medical field and she was telling me that nurses are in high demand. And she said," You know, there's a lot of recruiters who bring nurses near to the United States", and that kind of planted the seed to say, Well, maybe you know, if I'm a nurse as well, that might be a good transition, for me to be able to get a job and land in a hospital and then figure out what I want to do. And, you know, I applied to nursing school in my third year of med school. And, you know, I did I did the courses at the same time, which was a bit crazy.
Denise 11:36
At the same, the same school, the same university. Well,
Anca 11:39
it wasn't the nursing school, but it was, yes,
Denise 11:43
I'm just trying to I'm just trying to imagine somebody in the accounting department trying to actually studying both things at the same time. But nope, nobody noticed or nobody minded that you wanted to abuse yourself even more than medical school. Was pretty, pretty rough.
Anca 11:58
Yeah, there were some classes that I could I could transfer and then it was the, the extra practical aspects of nursing that I had to do. And you know, I was able to fit that into the schedule in the evenings, afternoons. So don't ask me how many hours? How long my day was.
Denise 12:23
So you graduated from both at the same? Yes, graduation ceremony. Okay. So but but once you finish that you work as a physician once you finish the exam, yes. Okay. Did you work control as a nurse once you graduated? waiting for the results period? Do you have to wait a long period there?
Anca 12:44
Yeah. So you know, I got my diploma, nursing diploma. And I took the test for the medical residency. Because I really wanted to start training in family medicine. And I didn't know about you know, how the timing what's what's gonna happen with a nursing and I want to make sure that I'm actually, you know, continuing on on my medical path there, while I was researching ways to, to go to United States, as you know, a nurse as a doctor, so it's, yeah, it's the medical field in Romania didn't pay pay much at that time. And that was another task very much
Denise 13:23
Doesn't pay much still. At what point did you start the actual paperwork trail to get yourself to the US? Did you go to a recruiter initially, and ask if you could come over as a nurse? How long did that process take?
Anca 13:40
Well, um, I got in touch with some recruiters. I actually convinced some, some of my colleagues went like back in the third year of medical school, and when I started doing the nursing process, I had a couple of friends who are also thinking to emigrate. So I showed them what I'm going to be doing. So they followed along and so the three of us were applying for nursing jobs and looking for recruiting agencies. And we found an agency that was recruiting for North Carolina. You know, we did the paperwork and you had to take the their CGFNS exam, which is, you know, to become a nurse in United States. So we're preparing for that together and, you know, got all the materials got all the paperwork together. And then, you know, they ended up pursuing that and I ended up finding my husband who actually lived in United States and I had a little detour.
Denise 14:40
Okay, so when you arrived here, as did you come over and get married, or did you get married in Romania and
Anca 14:45
you got married in Romania, who's Romanian?
Denise 14:48
So you came here as a new bride, and what we what did you do initially? Did you did you get a nursing job? Or did you just buckle down and study for the American exams? What did you do?
Yeah, so because he had a working work visa visa H1-A, or H1 B and I was a spouse I didn't have the right to work. So I had to be done with all the exams and be accepted and find a nursing programs. So I had to study for the for the tests and apply to different jobs. And so you know, that took me a little while in and find somebody who wanted to take new graduate I was considered a new graduate. So yeah, I ended up working at the at the hospital on their medical surgical floor. Orthopedics. What does your husband do? He's a software engineer. Okay.
Completely different. Yeah. So North Carolina ? He was based there or?
Anca 15:52
No, no, that was the recruiting agency. So okay, I ended up giving that up.
Denise 15:57
So where did you first live when you came to the US?
Anca 16:01
I first lived in Dallas, Texas for a few months, and then his job transferred to Seattle. So we lived in Seattle for about seven years. Okay.
Denise 16:10
So American licensing exams are federal level, so you could study there and then transfer up? And so at what point did you where and how did you find your way to a residency program for medicine, how long did it take you to get through the slew of exams that you must take if you come here, American take the first one after the second year of medicine. And the second one at some point, usually around your third year, because you've got to get paperwork in for the end of the fourth year. But if you're coming from abroad, having already done seven years of medicine, you've got to do all three exams, as fast as you can, how long did it take you to get through them?
Anca 16:53
I would say a couple of years of intense studying, like almost a year for for each of them. And the second and the third, I tried to pass them close together because I was pregnant at that time. So added a little just a little pressure.
Denise 17:09
Yeah, just a bit don't give me my due date for an exam date please. That wouldn't be good
Anca 17:16
Exactly, exactly. But yeah, I mean, it was a process with the paperwork. And in the first actually, in the first three years of nursing, I really liked what I was doing. So I was contemplating, you know, continuing to work as a nurse, but also figuring out the medical system. And, you know, I had an appointment with a primary care doctor when I landed in, like, after a few months in Seattle. And, you know, I had that list of six different things I wanted to talk to her about. And after the first two, she left the room, and I wasn't sure like, is she coming back? And then the nurse said, you know, time is up, and you just have to make another appointment. And, you know, I was a little surprised to hear that and to because back home, you know, the doctors will answer your questions. And even if you were waiting a little longer, you knew that, you know, they will, they will come back questions, they will come back. And so, you know, after that experience, I talking to other people, I realized that that's that's all the time the doctor was given. It wasn't like, it wasn't her fault that she had to leave the room, she had other patients waiting for her. And, you know, I was a little discouraged with that, because I felt like that that would not allow me to take care of fully of my patients and having the time limitation. So I had to think really hard about about actually going back to medicine because I felt very strongly that I cannot practice that way. And to the point where I felt like okay, the nursing is giving me the time of the patient that I need. And I was actually enjoying what I was doing quite a bit. And and then I was fortunate enough because I had some health issues, to find some inspiring physicians who are practicing differently and kinda was the change I needed. Or, you know, the inspiration I needed to change course. And I started I started studying for the boards. It took me a few years to kind of decided, okay, this is what I'm going to do. That's why, you know, the process took me about five years
Denise 19:30
To do all of the exams from when you got here,
Anca 19:34
when I got here
Denise 19:35
So you're on the cusp of them being nasty about when you finished school then because they usually give you about seven years to get through the process.
Anca 19:43
Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I think having the nursing experience has really helped and, you know, the doctors I worked with in the hospital really encouraged me and wrote nice letters. And I kind of knew that I want I wanted to do integrative medicine because because of this decision to say, I'm going to do things a little differently. And if I find a program that has integrated medicine incorporate it
Denise 20:13
Oh, where was that, where did you go?
Anca 20:15
So I initially applied to all of the eight programs that were with Andrew Weil's integrative medicine and residency, he had that he has a fellowship, and he has that program too. With the initially the pilot program had eight places and one of them was Maine, Dartmouth Integrative Program, in Maine.
Denise 20:34
So you go into a family medicine, but it's got a segment that's for Integrative Medicine. That's right. Okay. All right. And so you got into that one. What happened? Your husband had to work remotely, and we just moved way because it's the other side of the country!
Anca 20:48
Yeah, yeah. So we had to move over to Maine, because we had the two year old at that time. So we wanted to keep the family together. Yeah.
Denise 20:59
Well, software engineers usually don't have too much trouble finding jobs, wherever they want to be. No, usually can work remotely, which is fine. Yeah. So you did that what what was still striking you as as different from the system, both culturally and as a as a medical professional in your own country, which ones struck you the most, aside from, I'm sorry, your time is up. The constraints put on doctors, I don't think most doctors want to practice medicine by the clock , we want to be able to give the most time, the time that's needed. But of course, if you've got five people waiting for you, you also have to respect their time.
Anca 21:40
Yeah, so you know, I think it was the intensity of the of the training of the residency training with the 80 plus hours that we got in the, you know, first year, and just having to keep up with so much information in a short amount of time, which I felt was not so intense in Romania. So it was a different, a little different pace there. And, and, you know, getting keeping up to date with the technology and the latest guidelines and all that I I feel like yes, we do have guidelines in Europe, but I don't think that we were so pushed to check all the boxes. And so it was a little more more relaxed. Versus here, where I felt like it was a huge responsibility, where if I didn't cover everything in the, during the visit, like checking all the boxes, that that's, you know, gonna reflect negatively upon my review, which I you know, I'm competitive.
Denise 22:44
Most doctors are, but it's a side effect of a training. But do you think those boxes are genuinely addressed? There's a lot of boxes on those forms. And I go, I'm now nearly 70. And thanks to the new and improved version of Medicare that we have currently, I get a whole wellness exam every year, and they remind me every year to go to my doctor and make sure nothing's wrong. But if I'm, I can only address issues that we've already diagnosed, I can't bring up a new subject, because that's not a wellness exam. Yes, bonkers. And thankfully, if I want to see the doctor, I will get out my credit card and see one. But for a lot of people, that is not the case, that wellness check needs to be a safety net for a lot of our population. What? What as I know, you've decided that you want to have your own way of practicing and not deal with that. But in your address at once you were in training. Did you feel that your non-affluent patients had access to doctors in the way that they would have had it been in Europe? What do you think is the same a different sort of problem in Romania also? You left before they joined the EU so...
Anca 24:04
Yes. So you know, I think there is there is more of what this patient needs in the moment in Romania, what what are their pain points versus we gotta check this box? And otherwise, you'll have to come back in and here yes, ultimately, you're under those time constraints. And you gotta you gotta go through the questionnaires and make sure you have all the screenings done. And then if people have an acute problem, that's when I would get into trouble because I was trying to address it and, you know, you have the choice to do that, then get behind and, you know, not be, of course, reimburse for that extra time that you're spending it or, you know, follow the rules and have the patient come back, which was tough because I only had the number of patients or slots in the clinic in the following weeks. And if that was something more or gentle colleague of mine would have seen that patient and, you know, the medical care was was a little bit, you know, spread out to, like several practitioners and, and of course, the patients in residency were okay with that because they knew the system, but in other practices, they want to see their doctor and they want, you know, all their concerns addressed. Because you know, the other aspect is, that patient takes time out of their schedule to come see you. And it's not might not be so easy to come back.
Denise 25:34
Yeah. Okay, and what are the differences? Have you found? Admittedly 20 years is a long time. But what do you miss about Romania both in practice, and in just general society, my favorite thing I went, when my son was there, I've probably been to Iasi, five times and to the country seven. And my favorite thing is the very relaxed dining habits, you go for dinner, they you know, they'd look at you, if you want something new from wave, but they leave you alone, you spend seven hours in a restaurant, they'd be fine, even if you didn't order anything. Yeah, I think rushed eating is a big thing here.
Anca 26:15
Exactly. I think, you know, everything is so scheduled here. And I missed the, you know, enjoying life kind of aspect of things back in Europe. You know, yes, you are, you should be on a schedule there, but it's not as tight, then my days then tend to be so full there. And, yeah, it's interesting, just culturally, here, when you ask somebody, how are you? And they say, Fine, you don't know if they are fine or not over there. You know, when you ask them, How are you you've got to be prepared. You gotta have 15, 20 minutes for them to tell you their neighbor or cat or what happened in their lives? Because that's, that's what you know that the answer to that question is, what their how are they actually feeling? What are they doing? So it's like, here, if you don't feel well you're getting a therapist. There, you're just getting your neighbor, your friends to listen to you.
Denise 27:10
Do you think there would be as much of a need for integrative medicine practices in Romania, as there are here? Do you think it's already being practiced? Are they are they bringing in the other modalities into practice?
Anca 27:23
I was actually surprised when I went back home last summer, you know, I went with my father to a neurologist, and part of the part of the recommendations were some herbs and vitamins. And, you know, this was just, he wasn't an Integrative Neurologist on it, there's not much of, of that advertisement there. There's some clinics in Bucharest that are more integrative, but I feel like it's, it's part of, you know, blending in the best modalities we have. And if a supplement is, you know, pretty good, and they are gonna recommend it. And it's, it's not like frowned upon there as if it doesn't have this many randomized control studies, then we're not going to incorporate it in our recommendations. And so a lot of herbs that actually have that, but it's just about the awareness that, as doctors, we might not have had the time to read the articles or the studies or didn't have exposure, like I'm pretty fortunate to have had that in residency and to see that it's actually a lot of the, a lot of the, you know, complementary medicine modalities are, have been around for a number of years and are pretty effective. I'm very happy
Denise 28:36
to say that as a hypnotist, which is my current thing, that there are quite a few hypnotist who are doctors who was that, of course, once was about eight of us and one of the people was her name is also Anca, I think, she's in Bucharest, she's a hematologist, and she's a hypnotist as well. Interesting, interesting combination. But yeah, I was very happy to see that it was being fairly taken fairly seriously by most of the medical practitioners there.
Anca 29:06
Yeah, I think, you know, the old traditions also play a role because, you know, my grandma were was treating me with chamomile tea and all kinds of herbs when I was sick. And you know, when you get exposed to that, that then early age because you know, we're under communism, we didn't have so many of those resources, you had to figure it out. And you had to be very resourceful to treat yourself when you had an illness and go to the doctor when only when it was something significant. So, you know, the herbs use there and, you know, other healing modalities were very present when I was growing up.
Denise 29:43
So now that you're in practice in the US, do you have an integrative practice? Or do you is that sort of a sidekick to what you're doing? What are you currently, how are you practicing medicine?
Anca 29:54
Yeah, I have an integrative holistic practice. So I trained with Institute of functional medicine which gave me the framework to practice integrative medicine. And then you know that the training I had in residency helped me kind of put different aspects of modalities of integrative medicine together, like I do some acupuncture, some osteopathy, and, you know, nutrition. And ultimately, I'm looking as many doctors are to help people restore balance in their bodies. And yeah, that kind of stuck with me is the more you learn in medicine is like trying to fix all this little things. But ultimately, the body is such a, an amazing system that it knows how to rebalance itself. And if you give it the opportunity, the opportunity and and yes, and if you find the root causes or things that are out of balance, so that I think and ultimately, that's my goal with my patients. And so I named my practice Restore Balance for that reason.
Denise 30:59
And you you, haven't I the usual sort of office hours, do you have hospital privileges? Do you see people in hospital? Or do you? Are you purely office,
Anca 31:10
I don't I I'm just choosing to stay in the office and have people actually have a primary care physician and I'm more like a consultant for people who haven't been helped by by my specialist colleagues and the primary care. And you know, there's a lot of people who will want to include nutrition and supplements into their regimen. And they don't know exactly how to do that. So that those are the things I help them with. So it's mostly an integrative practice. And I spend quite a bit of time with each patient and you know, I had to choose to be a cash practitioner to be able to do that.
Denise 31:53
So you don't take any insurances?
Anca 31:55
I'm considered out of network. So I don't bill insurance directly. I give people
Denise 31:59
just that mean, you can't see Medicare Medicaid clients. That's just not
Anca 32:04
they see me, but they are not going to be reimbursed.
Denise 32:10
So they choose to see you. Okay, what else? Can I ask you? Lots of questions about Romania. How much? How much of your own country did you see before you left? You're in your books all the time. You get to did you get to tour much?
Anca 32:25
Yeah, you know, it's it's probably half of it. It's where the vacations take you and
Denise 32:34
most people don't have a very good sense of geography and don't realize how huge Romania is by European standards. It's a physically big country.
Anca 32:42
Yes, yes. And we have mountains and the Black Sea and it's beautiful. There. And yeah, we want to visit now more often with my son and because he wants to know his roots, and we want to travel to places we haven't been. And, you know, tourism has flourished there. And there's a lot of nice places to visit and history, a lot of history, of course.
Denise 33:07
Yeah, I was really didn't know anything other than Queen Marie because she was British. Until I actually was in Iasi which is pronounced Yash, but spelled Iasi. For those who never figure that out. It's, it's on the Silk Road, which completely amazed me, and it's a medieval city as it's a beautiful city, with a lot of Soviet buildings and a lot of modern architecture now, but beautiful, beautiful churches. Absolutely lovely place. Yeah, and really cold winters. Don't ever want to be there in a winter.
Anca 33:45
Well, not as cold as Maine here.
Denise 33:48
That's true. I used to work in Maine too, I used to do locum work, and I would go up and spend like two weeks up there and then fly back again. Spending a lot of time in Boston Airport snowbound couldn't fly out. . But where in Maine were you?
Anca 34:02
it was in Augusta, Maine. So that's the Yeah, yeah. We had a really good time there was a great group of physicians and heart centered and, yes, the training in residency is hard. But the people there made it much, much more doable and their caring attitude really impressed me because it was late, they would see you how tired you were after a call and then you know, sometimes you had a delivery after that 24 hour call and you're just barely your eyes open. And so, you know, it happened to me that they said, you know, you look very tired. Just go home. We'll take care of it.
Denise 34:46
Yeah, okay. So let's look back, looking back. What about our restrictions for residence in training there? I know you've only been training very briefly and as a medical student, you would have had more time off but as as a resident there What sort of hours? Did you have? Scandinavian clock hours? Sorry, my shift is finished. Somebody else is coming in to take over. Or did you stay there until the case was finished?
Anca 35:10
You mean in Romania? Yeah. Yeah. So um, we had more like clock hours in the first year of residency. So yeah, you would go home when this shift is over, and somebody will take over.
Denise 35:22
So how many hours a week do you think was resident? I've not studied time because of course, that's on top, but
Anca 35:27
probably 50 to 60. Yeah. Okay.
Denise 35:30
So what would be ideal here, but it's never been reached. I was before there were workcaps so 100 hours a week was pretty standard when I was an intern. Amazing, now I can't stay upright, nevermind with my brain engaged anymore. That work schedule. . So thank you. Is there anything else you would like to tell people before we go?
Anca 35:57
Yeah, it's interesting, looking back at my life, and your podcast kind of made me reflect a little bit to say, Well, yeah, it's a journey and taking it one step at a time. And I wouldn't have seen myself here with a private practice 20 years ago. And it's just enjoying each each step of the journey. And being in a medical doctor is is stressful. But I think it's also the joy of helping people and learning so much privilege, in some ways, it is, and it is, it is a gift for me, you know, we're getting ready to move and we just found some boxes, and there was a letter from the front desk, people at my residence. I actually worked a few years in Maine after the residency training, and now saying patients are calling very upset that you're moving to Virginia, expressing their gratitude to the work you've done. And it's those little things that bring me joy nowadays, you know, I just brought tears to my eyes to say I actually made a difference. And people would remember me and all this hard work and training is worthwhile. And, you know, it sounded from what she wrote there that I made a difference in people's lives, which, you know, it's like, yes, it's a lot of effort. And remember that, but you also remember that the smile you put on people's faces and how grateful they are they, you gave them a different path forward?
Denise 37:25
Do you think either any of your children will go into medicine?
Anca 37:30
We'll see. We'll see. I think it's, my son is more inclined towards technology. So being a
Denise 37:37
leaning software, okay. So that's a huge field within medicine too really, this is all sorts of things. Do you think your kids will go to Europe to to do any of their tertiary education?
Anca 37:54
Well, that's an option. And that's why, you know, I want to expose my son to the life in Europe a little bit to see if he likes it. And ultimately, it'll be his choice. But I want him to make an informed choice. And yeah, the the pace of life is a little different there, so he might enjoy that. We'll see. Yeah.
Denise 38:14
Thank you so much for joining me today. Thank you.
Anca 38:17
Thank you, Denise. It was a pleasure.
Denise 38:20
Thank you for joining us at Myth,Magic, Medicine. If you have found this episode useful, you can apply for free CME credit through the link provided in the transcript. If you're not a medical professional, please remember, while we're physicians, we're not your physicians, so please consult with your own health care professional if you think something you have heard might apply to you or a loved one. Until next time, bye bye.
