Denise Billen-Mejia 0:07
Welcome to Two hypnotherapists talking with me, Denise Billen-Mejia in Delaware, USA.
Martin Furber 0:13
And me Martin Furber in Preston UK.
Denise Billen-Mejia 0:16
This weekly podcast is for anyone and everyone who'd like to know more about fascinating subject of hypnosis, and the benefits it offers.
Martin Furber 0:24
I'm a clinical hypnotherapist and psychotherapist.
Denise Billen-Mejia 0:27
I'm a retired medical doctor and consulting hypnotist.
Martin Furber 0:31
We are two hypnotherapists talking.
Denise Billen-Mejia 0:34
So let's get on with the episode. Anyway. So today we're going to be talking about stress. Yeah,
Martin Furber 0:39
Apparently it's stress Awareness Month, the whole month of April.
Denise Billen-Mejia 0:46
Yeah, they also, part of my stress is the number of Hallmark moments we have everything's got a day. We were working on women, physicians day we had physicians famous last week.
Martin Furber 1:00
Yeah, well, I mean, it was a marketing thing,in the UK, wasn't it, when we started having all these different weeks, you know, like National sausage week or national meat pie week or whatever.
Denise Billen-Mejia 1:12
So as a vendor, as a person who markets, in order to have more clients come to you, do you find this stressful?
Martin Furber 1:21
Do I find it stressful? I did it first. Not now. Because first of all, I have to get over that thing of realising I am the product. I'm putting myself out there. I mean, if somebody's only ever come across me in the last couple of years, they're gonna think, oh my god, this guy's so in your face, he's out there. His name's on everything. His face is on everything. That can give people a perceived image, which is probably about as far removed from myself as a person as you could get. Because I'm actually an incredibly private person. And before I became a therapist, I never put my name to anything.
Denise Billen-Mejia 2:03
I signed a lot of legal documents because I was a doctor. I didn't go out asking people to come to my ER, I was very happy when people didn't have to come to the ER.
Martin Furber 2:12
I mean, having said that, in the States, a lot of doctors do advertise themselves, you know.
Denise Billen-Mejia 2:17
Private offices, but I was never in private practice. Yeah. Yeah.
Martin Furber 2:22
I remember seeing that when I was over there on holiday, and read in the newspapers all those years ago, solicitors and doctors took up a lot of the advertising space in the newspapers,
Denise Billen-Mejia 2:33
Solicitors particularly.
Martin Furber 2:35
And solicitors who sued doctors...
Denise Billen-Mejia 2:40
However, for the purposes of this current recording, yeah, we're gonna talk about I do think I do think it's important though, to acknowledge that stress is stress, whether it's good or bad. There's a young lady getting married on Saturday here, there's probably is all over the world, but she sent me a message, our assembly is handling the wedding. And she sent a message to make sure she had all the little bits of paper and she's gotten everything done. And I wrote back yes, we've got everything now. Thank you. Now remember, deep, slow breaths. Because she knows she's on the calendar. She's get married Saturday, it's a few days.
Martin Furber 3:23
Well, this is one of those things. I've said it before. Okay. The biggest things in our lives, we are supposed to look forward to. That are supposed to give us the most joy. Getting married, buying our first home or renting our first home, having a kid Yep, learning to drive. Buying a car, having children getting married. They're also the most stressful.
Denise Billen-Mejia 3:48
Yeah, and then you got the ones that are obviously upsetting as well as stressful, such as dealing with probate. Yeah.
Martin Furber 3:55
Yeah, it's really, really stressful. Extremely stressful. Yeah, so it's like, is there good stress and bad stress?
Denise Billen-Mejia 4:08
Well, yes, because you want all those things in the first list to happen. And the other things are inevitable. I mean, eventually, you know, maybe not probate, but so it is a given, that none of us will leave here alive as they say. But it is in the moment is very stressful because of the change in your circumstances. This is like when you say that's what gets me out of bed every morning. It is something tells you I have to react to this, whatever this is, it isn't the case of getting up it's probably opening our eyes and realising the time on the clock.
Martin Furber 4:43
I've been writing about this month as well for my newspaper articles, with it being stress Awareness Month. I was trying to explain how we need to have that sweet spot. Okay. So when we're stressed we fire up, amongst other things, cortisol and adrenaline instantly. Okay, and that's the same thing that gets us out of bed in the morning and motivates us. Yeah. Yeah. I'm waiting for a non there Denise!
Denise Billen-Mejia 5:16
Yes, dear.
Martin Furber 5:18
Okay, so then, when does it cease to be good stress and become bad stress? So say for example, say for example, I want to ace some kind of presentation at work. Okay? I would get some bad stress or get some adrenaline and cortisol, maybe start to worry a little bit, will it be okay, will it go right? But also, that's the same stress that would motivate me to do it in a good way. And also, because I always say it's like to learn anything in life, you've got to push yourself out of that comfort zone, haven't you?
Denise Billen-Mejia 5:51
Don't diss cortisol, we do need it. If you don't have it, you have a problem. Yeah. So I think that perhaps the issue is not whether it's good or bad, it's whether you have so much of it. And your own level of tolerance will vary. But you know, if you're planning a wedding, and then there's a flood in your house, because, well here because plumbing goes bad, but you know, just something that you could normally manage without any problem at all, but you're already using all of your anxiety threats. And that's, that one thing just tipped you over the edge. Yeah. And that's when people think of it as as bad stress.
Martin Furber 6:40
Yeah, I mean, I'm just giggling to myself there, Denise because this very week last year, in the space of a week of my car engine blew up, my house flooded, my best friend of 40 years died. And my cat died all in the space of a week. And I can remember commenting at the time, feeling this, I wouldn't say serenity about me, but feeling this ability to cope with it all and thinking, I'm so glad I was trained in dealing with stress. Or having, that having been said, I don't feel I was too far away from the old metaphorical stress bucket overflowing have one more thing happened. For example, I think that might have just sort of tipped me over the edge, as it were, and my abilities to cope.
Denise Billen-Mejia 7:31
Well, what do you use in order to cope with it apart from all the good things like deep breathing, relaxing and giving yourself time to breathe or whatever,
Martin Furber 7:41
I try to sleep well, or as people say, these days, engage good sleep hygiene. I do try to sleep well. Currently. Now our clocks have just gone forward over here. Okay, the mornings are still okay. But I know another month from now, it's going to be daylight at like five in the morning.
Denise Billen-Mejia 8:03
And go on til almost ten.
Martin Furber 8:06
Yeah. Yeah. So that concerns me. I don't have very much trouble getting to sleep at night. I do, again, stress signature, when my mind is too overloaded, then I may well wake up extra early and not be able to get back to sleep. That, I would say is one of my stress signatures.
Denise Billen-Mejia 8:29
So when that happens, not necessarily the insomnia. But recognising that you're overstressed and you're not enjoying it. It's not a fun that you're doing. What sorts of things do you change in order to?
Martin Furber 8:46
Okay, well, this is the thing. Ideally, for me, the best possible thing for me to do is to make sure I take two hours out of the day, and go for a really long walk, there are two particular long walks I like to do where I live. Unfortunately, where I live, we get more rain here, then, I don't know where else in the country. I'm just on the west Pennines. It's a very, very rainy area. And when it's raining too heavily, you know, there's no pleasure in doing a four mile uphill walk.
Denise Billen-Mejia 9:17
And there's possibly some danger and possibly as well.
Martin Furber 9:22
I still say it. It's the simplest of things for me, going for a really good long walk to the point where you don't feel inclined to do it, the first 20 minutes you're just thinking, I wish I was back at home, but after you've gone to about 40 minutes, it's like wow, when you're just in the moment and that's how long it takes me to de-stress get in the moment, excuse me, and really enjoy the walk. And that absolutely de stresses me.
Denise Billen-Mejia 9:51
That is one of my lifelong uses, particularly if I was angry about something and if it was raining, I loved it. I loved to walk in the rain, you get soaking wet until the end of my walk. And that helped me de-stress, nowadays that's less available to me.
Martin Furber 10:10
Okay, so when you use to do that, though, like you say, if you were angry, maybe you've had an argument with somebody or a disagreement, maybe even a professional disagreement or something. Would you unravel that argument in your head during the walk?
Denise Billen-Mejia 10:23
Yes.
Martin Furber 10:23
Would you be able to forget that argument during the walk?
Denise Billen-Mejia 10:27
No, I didn't forget it. I replayed it. But I was gonna do that if I was sitting at my desk. So if I had the opportunity to walk it off I was maybe it's like some version of EMDR, is where you were using your body whilst something else or something else is playing, but I haven't been able to do that that much the last few years. Okay, when we moved, it became, and setting up business in the house. I still will go for walks for, you know, 20 minutes or so. But really long walks and weekend things. Yeah, instead, even if I'm not actually cross and needing to have an argument with somebody in my head, on the weekends, just having had that exercise is going to help me cope with the various things, like dealing with the bank this morning. I've just remembered I need to call the repairman, to come and give me the estimate he said he was going to do last Tuesday.
Martin Furber 11:21
Oh
Denise Billen-Mejia 11:21
It's those issues are niggling stresses for me. I don't have very many huge ones. I've had them in the past. Everybody does. But it's the niggly ones that just put you out of sorts, because it should be so simple to do this. Why don't you just make a phone call?
Martin Furber 11:38
Oh, brilliant. Yeah, it's, I mean, for me, what I've done is because, as we all know from our very short episode a few weeks ago, I've been under, sort of like huge pressure and had a massive workload to deal with this last couple of months. As have we both actually. And I did miss a few days of my walking, and I could really feel the difference. So I've made the most of the Easter weekend and gone on some really long walks. Everyday between now and next Monday, I am planning to fit it into my diary two hours a day to do some serious walking. And I know that that will help me with my sleep and I'll be feeling so much better.
Denise Billen-Mejia 12:19
It's another reminder for those of us who have people schedule their appointments to put the things that we don't want them interrupting in there too. I was gonna go for a walk. But oh, I've got three clients.
Martin Furber 12:35
Do you refer to a sort of metaphorical stress bucket with your clients?
Denise Billen-Mejia 12:39
I occasionally do. But that's based on you. I just refer to space, I, my visualisation is not very good, yeah, I'm aware, we've got one right now as you know, Francisco does contract work. And the last contract ended in February, usually takes a month or two to get something else. And it just feels like it's taking longer. And actually when I think about it, and plot it out, it's actually taking the same amount of time. And it is money, this is, we can live quite well, without either of us having new money coming in. We've got savings, but it's still stressful. And he likes working. Yeah, and I don't want to listen to him talking about engineering. But um, whatever time somebody tells him something, or we get the headhunter calls you first, you say yes, I might be interested in that. And then you have a conversation with somebody, then you have a formal interview that, you know, just that in itself is stressful, even though it's potentially good, and nothing bad will happen, becasue the worst thing that can happen is you don't decide to take that job or they'll decide not to employ you. Yeah, that's so that's not there's no negative aspect to it. But it's still stressful.
Martin Furber 14:06
Things we look forward to but it's so so stressful.
Denise Billen-Mejia 14:09
But, I think it's mainly that you don't know what the outcome is going to be.
Martin Furber 14:13
No, I say it's that thing of the unknown, isn't it? It's that uncertainty, uncertainty that is a stressor for most people. But also this thing. I mean, I've had it a few times with people that I've spoken to, like you know, since I've been a therapist, and go for an interview is one of the most stressful things and it's, you know, they say to me, they can rehearse, rehearse, rehearse, read or read or read or find out everything about the company before the interview. Then get to the interview, their mind goes blank.
Denise Billen-Mejia 14:43
Yeah. I think that's sort of stage fright. The worst thing actually feared more than death in some statistics is public speaking. And it's the same thing you don't know.
Martin Furber 14:56
But I used to get it with exams at school. I would revise, I would do the work in the term with no problems with my term work. Just a complete mental block, which is something hypnotherapy is good at helping with.
Denise Billen-Mejia 15:14
Yes, and the thing I should try and stress to people. Once you've been hypnotised formally, you will have learned how to do this for yourself. Although you may enjoy going to a hypnotist and chatty part of it, you would be able to apply if you've if you've gone to a hypnotist, because you want to deal with public speaking, or you want to deal with bad sleep patterns, or whatever. The very things that we put in place with that, will help you with all the other things in life. It's like this stress, right?
Martin Furber 15:44
Yeah, absolutely, I mean, I also mean with clients as well. And I know you do this as well, is giving them the tools or suggestions that they need to engage in mentally healthy behaviour and keep themselves fresh and keep the mind in a good place. You know, explaining the benefits of walking, because it's okay to you know, go for a walk, you feel better, people like to know why. And, you know, I'm not saying you need a full scientific breakdown. But when we explain how our minds work and things and just how these benefits tools, people feel more empowered. And I think when people feel more empowered, they're more inclined to do something.
Denise Billen-Mejia 16:21
But don't want leave people thinking they have to go walking, to de-stress you do. It's a good idea to walk, but you could, I think one of my more stressful things I've done, I can remember, the situation was when a friend's husband died. It's a several years ago, there have been several since then, I've reached that age. But I had gone to the hospital, was with her and her family. And we knew it was it was inevitable. I left around two or 3am and got a text a couple of hours later that he had passed. And she had loads of family around her immediate family was around and family were flying in from all over. She did not need me physically to be there. But I, for my own stress had to do something. So I made soup. Do you have any idea how therapeutic it is to chop vegetables, especially if you don't care what shape they are. It was very, very therapeutic. And I remember it, I remember what the recipe was because I had pulled it out of something. And since then, I've always known it by as his name soup.
Martin Furber 17:32
Well, that I can relate to that. Because as I've said quite a few times now as well. One of my big things to de-stress is to play random music on YouTube, where I make the first selection and YouTube selects the rest of it, and do the ironing at the same time.
Denise Billen-Mejia 17:50
Ironing's a stress reliever, there's a thing!
Martin Furber 17:53
Yeah, yeah, as long as you don't burn your fingers.
Denise Billen-Mejia 17:55
Or the clothes, whatever.
Martin Furber 17:58
Well, yeah, that happens now and again, but, because you've got to get in the moment, you've got to concentrate seriously, so you don't burn your fingers. And because you're blasting music out and you don't know what's coming next, I just get completely into that moment. That's how I can forget things. That's the kind of forgetting de-stress. To unravel things in my mind, that's when I go on a walk.
Denise Billen-Mejia 18:21
It's not so much you've forgotten it. But you've laid it aside for now.
Martin Furber 18:24
Yeah, I'm able to put those thoughts aside and get in the moment of just doing the ironing and listening to the music. But as I say, to unravel things, to sort things out in my head, and put it in layman's terms. I go for will go long walk, good long walk does the job every time for me. Absolutely. I've made plenty of time this week to really get back into it. No excuses. Now the workloads lightening the days are light and evenings are longer.
Denise Billen-Mejia 18:51
Though, you've had you've had two major projects that have come up. So yeah, yeah. Your new teaching one and the one for PAC. So it's, it's a lot of..
Martin Furber 19:00
It's full-on.
Denise Billen-Mejia 19:04
It's great stress, but it's stress. It's got to take some Yeah, it's it takes up mental bandwidth, and then something you don't particularly enjoy comes along and wants to get into it.
Martin Furber 19:15
Yeah, so yeah, so I'm just getting on with it. So just going back then a minute ago, because I was saying about a metaphorical stress bucket. I would imagine a lot of our viewers and listeners, you know have never been clients of mine and may not be that familiar with the term. So I thought we could just explain that.
Denise Billen-Mejia 19:33
Okay, please do please do. It's yours. It's your expression, although I know you did not mint it.
Martin Furber 19:39
Now I didn't, far from it. You know, MHFA England refer to a stress container. Lots of therapists over here refer to a stress bucket. And basically we just say that our vulnerability to stress is dictated first of all by the size of the bucket. As in the bigger the bucket the more stress we can handle without it overflowing.
Denise Billen-Mejia 20:02
You think you acquire a bigger bucket, because you have been taught as a child to handle stress well?
Martin Furber 20:08
Yes, because you've got an ability to deal with things, in all kinds of things, that sort of emotional maturity. As you've been taught, as you grow up how to deal with situations how to form, maintain, and when necessary end relationships, for example, friendships, that kind of thing, and how to cope with things without losing control. And I think yeah, but also, sort of conversely, if a child faced a lot of insecurity when they were younger, if they were bullied, if perhaps, that their parents either didn't or weren't able to look after them so well, that person may grow up to have a smaller stress bucket. And may also be more vulnerable to having a lot of stressors put in there. So we say that the ability to handle stress is dictated by the size of the bucket. So the bigger the bucket, the more stress we can carry with us, then...
Denise Billen-Mejia 21:14
You shouldn't feel the need to walk around with a filled up bucket all the time.
Martin Furber 21:18
You're pre-empting my next bit, you need to empty it on a daily basis. We do say that there's always a little bit of stress in the bottom for all of us. But what we say is one, you want to limit the amount of stress that goes in there. And we talk about that. And also engaging in the kind of behaviour which encourages the bucket to drain on a you know, sort of on a daily and on a longer term basis. So the one on a daily basis we talk about is the REM sleep. But also other things are we talking therapy over here about the four P's, which is sort of positive actions, positive interactions, positive thinking, and the fourth P is purpose having a purpose. Finding a purpose if needs be.
Denise Billen-Mejia 22:08
Usually important. Hmm, yeah, yeah.
Martin Furber 22:11
But it's like having that sense of belonging as well, isn't it?
Denise Billen-Mejia 22:16
Have a support system.
Martin Furber 22:18
Yeah, but also, as you know, as humans, we all need to feel that sense of belonging don't we, whether it's within our communities, whether it's within our religion, whether it's within our college, or whether it's within a group of friends that we play certain sports with, we all like that sense of belonging, knowing. And I think if we don't have that, that's when our sort of mental wellbeing can suffer, because even people who, like their own company an awful lot, I don't think in my experience anyway, that anybody likes to be completely alone, most of the time.
Denise Billen-Mejia 22:57
No, even people who say that they are introverted, they just need to have some alone time to decompress after being in a party of several hundred people. This is the perfect time to have a stress week is the last month you've got to get your taxes done. That's a really stressful thing. Even though you know, you'll have a wonderful endorphin rush when you finish them. Yeah, especially especially a little ticker in the corner's coming up green, you're gonna get money back. Everybody borrows trouble, one of my favourite expressions, and procrastinates it, which makes the problem worse. And there's thinking about that. And this is true, I think of anything you don't want to do. The longer you put it off, the more stress you're going to have in dealing with it.
Martin Furber 23:47
Well, but, conversely, the bigger the reward when you finally get around to doing it.
Denise Billen-Mejia 23:52
Yes, but that would imply that it's a good thing to do.
Martin Furber 23:55
No, I'm not saying it's a good thing to do. I'm just saying though, there is a bigger reward.
Denise Billen-Mejia 23:58
Then I would, then I wouldn't call it a reward. Your subconscious will say oh, let's wait until the night before.
Martin Furber 24:06
Yeah, I used to be a devil for doing this. In my previous business. We used to have to do a VAT return every quarter. And I used to put it off and put it off and put it off because it was a load of paperwork. I'm talking pre QuickBooks here. A load of paperwork, every single invoice every single receipt. For everything you've purchased every single invoice for everything you've sold and you get a whole lot stacking them up, itemise them, write them out, work it all out. When when I'd done it though, I'd always leave it to the very last minute. Always, always, always. And when I've done it, I used to feel fantastic. And I always every single time used to think why did you leave me so long? next quarter. I'm not going to do that every single quarter. I did.
Denise Billen-Mejia 24:51
You were saying the next quarter. You're already in the next quarter by the time you filled that one. Yes. So now why do you think That sense of reward was better when you had How long do you have to file for? It's the 31st of March and you have to file by the end of April.
Martin Furber 25:10
Yeah, you got to file. if your quarter ended 31st of March, you'd have to well, by the 30th of April. When we went digital, you got an extra seven days. Great. And I used to push it to that as well.
Denise Billen-Mejia 25:21
That was nice.
Martin Furber 25:22
I think the main thing was, the things I always used to pay a lot of money on my VAT. So fair enough. I just didn't like doing it as a tax collector for the government. Yes. It's what you call purchase tax over there. Or sales tax. Which is a deep rooted subconscious thing. I just begrudged doing it. You know, as an unpaid tax collector for the government.
Denise Billen-Mejia 25:52
I just think that all of the niggling stress that you had, going up to it, you knew you had the money in the bank, you knew that you you know, it wasn't that kind of stress, which a lot of people have, it just takes over a year. It's one medical disaster and your budgets completely shot. Oh, yeah. Doesn't have to be that big an issue either. But why did you feel what what made you continue to put it off? Do you still do this? No, I know, it's not the same. You don't say you just it's not the same volume either?
Martin Furber 26:28
No, it's not the same volume and everything's done quick book these days. I just fill it in as I go along. And when you want to know how much you owe, you just press a button and it tells you.
Denise Billen-Mejia 26:36
Okay, do you use Do you significantly miss the feeling of reward that you got at the end of your procrastination moments?
Martin Furber 26:43
I can. I can live without that.
Denise Billen-Mejia 26:48
Okay, I feel quite distressed by now.
Martin Furber 26:52
Listeners will feel de-stressed after this episode.
Denise Billen-Mejia 26:55
And do remember that although hypnotist, in conversation on podcasts, go all over the place. When we have a particular client in front of us, we can focus completely on what that guidance issue is.
Martin Furber 27:07
Well, we'll catch you on the next one.
Denise Billen-Mejia 27:09
All right, yeah. Bye bye. Bye bye.
Denise Billen-Mejia 27:19
We hope you've enjoyed listening. Please remember, this podcast is designed to give you an insight into therapeutic hypnosis. That is for educational purposes only to remember, consult with your own healthcare professional if you think something you've heard may apply to you or a loved one.
Martin Furber 27:34
If you found this episode useful, you can apply for free continuing professional development or CME credits. Using the link provided in the show notes. Feel free to contact either of us through the links in the show notes. Join us again next week.
